Press conference by President of the Government and Prime Minister of the Republic of Ireland

Madrid

President of the Government.- Ladies and gentlemen, a very good afternoon to you and thank you very much for attending.

For me it is a pleasure to receive the Prime Minister of Ireland, my friend Taoiseach Enda Kenny, here today in Madrid. I would now like to formally thank the Prime Minister and his delegation, and welcome them to Spain, on this occasion, to Madrid. We have seen each other on many occasions at European Councils, but the last time we held a bilateral meeting was in Granada, back in 2013, taking advantage of the Prime Minister's participation in a seminar on European policy, organised in Granada, specifically in Loja.

Things have changed a great deal since then, and we find ourselves today facing a panorama marked by new challenges and new opportunities. Both Ireland and Spain, as you are aware, have gone through major political and economic cycles in the time since that last bilateral meeting I just mentioned.

Both countries have recently held elections that have led to the formation of a government. After great sacrifices, our two countries have also significantly shown an improvement in our economies with figures that take on a special value because they affect the direct well-being of our citizens. And both countries can say that we have got back on to the path of economic growth and job creation.

And also, and this is worthy of mention, both our countries face the major challenge of the upcoming exit of the United Kingdom from the European Union. As you are all aware, the British Government plans to notify its intention to leave the EU before the end of March, in the terms established in Article 50 of the Treaty of the Union.

In these negotiations, which will foreseeably begin in the coming months, Spain and Ireland will work to maintain the interests of both countries and defend the rights of their citizens whilst maintaining the best possible relations with the United Kingdom. We will not renounce the essential principles of the European project, such as the indivisibility of the four freedoms of the Internal Market, nor will we renounce our pro-European vocation. We must continue to back European economic and political integration.

Our understanding also extends to bilateral affairs and international relations. At a bilateral level, the special harmony between our two countries is particularly evident in the impressive tourism figures: Spain is the leading holiday destination for Irish residents and it is estimated that in 2016, 1.7 million Irish citizens visited Spain. Bearing in mind that the population of Ireland is 4.7 million, this means that approximately one-third of the entire Irish population visited Spain. We should also welcome the continual increase of Spanish tourists to Ireland, which is estimated to have increased in 2016 by almost 35% on the figures for 2012.

Prime Minister Kenny and I also reviewed the most important issues of international current affairs. Firstly, we agreed on the grave threat posed by Jihadi terrorism, to which end we must all make an effort to wipe out their geographic bases, wherever they may be.

In relation to Syria and Libya, we agreed on the need to find a peaceful solution, the only possible solution, that respects the territorial integrity, sovereignty and independence of these countries.

As regards the situation in Ukraine, we agreed that the Minsk Accords are the most appropriate route to achieving stability in the country. Furthermore, both our countries support the important work being done by France and Germany under the so-called Normandy Format.

Finally, we reviewed various regional issues related to Latin America that are of mutual interest to our countries.

I would like to add something very important, and the value of this must be taken into consideration, and that is the tremendous effort made in recent years by both the people and the Government of Ireland. Ireland underwent a very difficult period, but today we can say that it is the European Union country to enjoy the fastest rate of economic growth; it is also creating a high number of jobs and has improved on all its macro-economic figures. It is undoubtedly a country that has an important future in the years to come and, in all honesty, what has been done in Ireland also helps us and is a stimulus because, as I said at the start of my speech, we underwent a similar situation.

Nowadays in Spain, in the wake of five years of negative economic growth, something that has never before happened in Spain's past, we are also coming out of a very complex situation. We had lost 10% of our Gross Domestic Product which we will recover this year; many jobs had been shed which have now been recovered and, if we are capable of continuing along these lines and down this path, we will assuredly once again return to the best levels of the Spanish economy in the near future.

I wish to particularly thank Prime Minister Kenny for coming to visit our country, where he is always welcome. The only thing I have to say about our bilateral relations is that they are wonderful. Fortunately, there are no contentious issues pending and the only thing prevailing is a shared firm desire to continue improving in the future, always to the benefit of our people, which is the ultimate goal.

So, once again, thank you very much, Enda, for being here with us.

Mr. Kenny.- Thank you very much, Mariano. I am delighted to be here in Madrid. This is my first trip to visit another leader in this New Year and I would like to visit as many as possible in the near future.

I have known President of the Government Rajoy for many years now; we have a very good working relationship. Spain and Ireland have historical ties that are important and that have defined our peoples, both here in Spain, and in Ireland.

I have spoken with the President of the Government about both his situation and ours. We had a very large majority in the government in the last legislature whereas we are now operating as a minority government, a similar situation to which President of the Government Rajoy finds himself in now: two general elections, 10 months without a government; he has had to form a government for the sake of those institutions that work for their citizens. And this, I said to him, requires a different mindset, it requires understanding that there are other voices that wish to be heard. This is similar to the agreements we have had to reach between our Cabinet and other members of the opposition that back us. We are going to comply with these agreements, but this requires a different mentality. It is very easy to approve things with an absolute majority. The President of the Government finds himself in a similar situation. I believe that these are important lessons that we must learn from.

We have indeed spoken about tourism. More than 1.7 million people came from Ireland to Spain in 2016 and 400,000 Spaniards visited Ireland. Clearly these relations are very cordial and we must boost them even further.

As regards another issue, the Spanish language, and I have discussed this with the President of the Government, more than 400 million people speak the language and I am going to ask the Minister for Education to consider this when drawing up our programmes for school education. This is important, because 40,000 Spaniards come to Ireland each year to learn English, and that is a question I will discuss with the Minister for Education.

Trade is another very important issue between our two countries.

We have also spoken about security, about criminal mafias, about drug trafficking, and I would like to say that there is a very close relationship between the Irish Police (Garda) and the Spanish Police. We have a liaison officer here in Madrid, who does a great job and there are also Spanish police officers who have travelled to Ireland to help fight the criminal gangs and drug trafficking gangs.

We have also discussed other issues, such as Syria, as the President of the Government mentioned, the destabilisation of Ukraine, the annexing of Crimea and the question of migration. On this last issue, I have said that Spain is very experienced; for several years it has been tackling the migratory question in a very original manner and this is reflected in the agreements that the European Union is signing with African countries. It is a question of offering job opportunities to the people of these countries and to help their economies grow; that is something important.

We have also spoken about 'Brexit' for a considerable time. This is important for both our countries. The economic indicators would seem to show that Ireland will be the country most affected by a hard 'Brexit' and, in light of the trade relations between Spain and the United Kingdom, and the number of British residents here in Spain, and the number of Spanish residents in the United kingdom, these are also important factors for Spain, as they are for us. What we want to see is for events to unfold that leave the situation as similar as possible to what we have at present, since we have intense trade relations.

I have outlined for the President of the Government the special circumstances in Ireland in relation to the ties between the United Kingdom and Ireland for many years now, the Common Travel Area and the fact that we have a unique circumstance in terms of Northern Ireland. We have spoken about this question, which we spent a considerable amount of time on.

So, we are going to continue in close contact, because the European Council cannot take decisions until such time as the position of the British Government is absolutely clear on the nature of the relations it wishes to have with the European Union once Article 50 is invoked. And that is a question that will only officially take effect when Prime Minister May sends the European Commission a letter activating Article 50.

I also explained to the President of the Government the situation that has been proposed in terms of the Northern Ireland Assembly, which is presently in a situation whereby it is deciding on the next step to take. President of the Government Rajoy appreciates the special circumstances that apply in Ireland.

And that is the situation. We are going to continue in close contact. We see each other at the meetings of the European Council and our diplomats are in regular contact, and I would like to thank Ambassador Cooney for what he is doing in this regard.

Our priorities, in terms of 'Brexit', are our economy, our jobs and maintaining the tradition we have had with the Common Travel Area and, as members of the European Union, we will carry out these negotiations as and when the time is right.
I believe that this meeting has been very beneficial and I would like to thank Mariano for his hospitality. I am delighted to be here, in Madrid, today.

Q.- I have a question for the Prime Minister. Have you received guarantees that the Government of Spain will support Ireland, in the sense that the case of Ireland is special in terms of the peace process and the border?

Then I wanted to ask the President of the Government a question.

Mr. Kenny.- In this regard, yes, we have spoken about this issue with the President of the Government. I explained the special circumstances that apply in Northern Ireland to him and he is well aware of the unique circumstances prevailing in Ireland. Europe has backed the peace process and the United States is aware of this. It is aware that there is an internationally binding agreement, the Good Friday Agreement, which means that the institutions of the Assembly work for the benefit of the people of Northern Ireland and that the Good Friday Agreement is applicable in full. This means respecting and appreciating the ability to work together to the benefit of all concerned.

President of the Government Rajoy fully supports this process, as he has always done.

Q.- President of the Government, do you support the efforts of the Irish Government in that it considers itself to be a special case in the 'Brexit' negotiations, in light of the border situation and the peace process?

President of the Government.- I believe that the Prime Minister has given a very clear answer. We are talking about a territory which, at this time, is undergoing a peace process, which is indeed backed by the European Union and the United States, and hence, my position is that we should, and we will continue to do so, help it in the future.

Q.- I wanted you both to give me your assessment of the press conference offered yesterday by the incoming President of the United States, whether you believe that there are grounds for the European Union to be concerned at what this Presidency may bring and whether we ought to think about adopting a common position to address this.

And for the President of the Government, if you will allow me, a question on a domestic issue. Following yesterday's meeting between the Vice-President of the Government and the Vice-president of the Regional Government of Catalonia, I wanted to know whether you see this attempt at dialogue as a failure, since the only path they are plotting is for a referendum and, in view of the potential meeting between you and the President of the Regional Government of Catalonia, do you feel that this would be feasible this very month?

President of the Government.- Those are two different questions. Personally, I am not, as is my custom and as you are perfectly aware, going to make comments on the comments of others, on press conferences or statements that other political leaders may make, more so when this takes place outside of my country and more so when he hasn't even taken up the post of President, which will take place, as you are aware, on 20 January.

I have clear what my responsibility as President of the Government of Spain is, and I think that this is something that most Spaniards share, and that is of the need for the best possible relations with all other governments, particularly with the United States Government. We have had wonderful relations recently. President Obama was here, as you all know, not long ago, and even more recently than his trip to Spain, I had the chance to take part, together with other European leaders, in a meeting with him in Berlin. Hence, what we want is to have the best possible relations at a bilateral level and also as members of the European Union, in NATO and other forums at which the interests of the citizens of these countries are defended.

When Mr Trump takes up his post as President of the United States, we will work to get to know each other better, to understand each other better and to try to resolve together, through a fruitful collaboration, those issues that are of interest to both parties. That obviously involves talking frankly and clearly about those issues that, as always tends to happen, we disagree on, because it is impossible to agree all the time on what one says and does.

So, I repeat, that is my position and my fundamental goal, for the benefit of the interests of the Spanish people, is to have the best possible relations with the United States.

As regards the meeting you mentioned between Mr Junqueras and the Vice-President of the Government, I should say that no attempt at dialogue has been a failure and that I will obviously not tire of trying to always engage in dialogue, but yes I would like to make some things clear.

We are now facing a wonderful opportunity, the Conference of Regional Presidents, to be held next week, where issues will be addressed that affect the people of Spain as a whole, and these are all important issues, precisely because that is the goal of this conference; for it to be operational and to all tackle together those things that, in the medium and long term, are of greatest importance to the Spanish people, starting with the sustainability of the Welfare State, issues of healthcare, pensions, education and regional financing; in other words, the important matters.

And this legislature, which is one of dialogue, of extensive dialogue, in which we have the possibility of using this to resolve issues affecting our future, in relation to this I would like to see everyone doing just that.

What I do want to state clearly, because it makes no sense to kid ourselves, is that I am not going to authorise any referendum to be held that affects the unity of Spain, national sovereignty or the equality of the Spanish people, and I am not going to do that for two reasons: firstly, because I am unable to, I do not have the legal authority to do so; and secondly, because it is something I do not believe in. I do not believe that the unity of Spain, or national sovereignty, or the equality of the Spanish people is there to give away, not here or in any other country.

But, aside from that, I believe that we can talk and reach understandings. In fact, contacts have been stepped up, as with other regional governments, by the cabinet ministers and the Vice-President of the Government. And I would like them to take a first step by attending the Conference of Regional Presidents, and not leave an empty seat because, in all truth, when you leave a set empty, someone else ends up taking it.

As regards the date, or whether or not we are going to meet up soon, there has been very fluid dialogue and I imagine there will be no problem in us seeing each other soon. But, I repeat, what is important is for there to be fluid dialogue and what is important is clarity in the government's position. A referendum that seeks or can be used to do away with national sovereignty, the unity of Spain or the equality of the Spanish people will not be held.

Aside from that, we are prepared to talk about anything: about the Budget, investments and other issues that truly affect the day-to-day lives of people. In all honesty, I believe that this is a reasonable, open and sensible position, and that any other approach would lead nowhere good for the interests of the people.

Mr. Kenny.- With regard to Catalonia, that is a domestic question for Spain and I will not remark on it.

I did not see the press conference you mentioned, I heard what was said about it and it would seem that this press conference is somewhat more structured.

The Presidency of the United States is the most important political position in the world and what I am interested in is what will come out of the new administration that will take on this position once President Trump is invested on 20 January; that is the most important thing.

I spoke with him not long after he won the elections, in his role as President-Elect, and I said several things to him about politics in general and about those issues that affect our country. I look forward to working with the new United States Government and continue with the good and intense relations that my country, Ireland, has had and still has with the United States in terms of employment, trade, etc., and in other areas as well, in which we have been forging contacts for the last two and a half centuries.

Q.- In the last hour, after meeting with Charles Flanagan, James Brokenshire has said that elections are likely in Northern Ireland. Are you disappointed because the speech you gave yesterday has not panned out, even before this initiative has been tried out? What effect will this have on 'Brexit'? Will a joint position be adopted?

President of the Government Rajoy has said that you had spoken about the criminal mafias that operate between Ireland and Spain. It is said in Ireland that these criminals believe they are untouchable; they have so much ill-gained wealth that they believe they are untouchable. What guarantees have you given the Prime Minister to stop this type of criminal activity and what resources can you jointly allocate, such as a standing working group to tackle this type of offence?

And, harking back to a question by one of my colleagues, is Ireland a special case or not? Is Ireland a special case in relation to 'Brexit'?

Mr. Kenny.- As regards your first question, I am always hopeful on policy matters. You must be an optimist to be in politics. The fact that the Deputy First Minister has resigned gives rise to a situation that the government cannot sustain because it is a coalition government with shared power.

Arlene Foster has said that she would be prepared to hold talks, but I don't know whether these talks will end up taking place. I cannot say what has to be done, I am not in a position to do that, but I will do what I can to facilitate talks for something that is very important for the people of Northern Ireland, for Ireland as a whole and also beyond that. This means that it is very clear what this power-share intends to offer: equality, respect, trust and the ability to work together. And elections won't be triggered until 5 pm on Monday, when the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland has no other option but to call elections if the situation has not changed by then.

Hence, the Sinn Fein party, which I spoke with yesterday, pointed out that they are fully prepared to hold talks. I imagine they have spoken with Arlene Foster and I hope that these talks can be held, but it is not down to me to tell them what they must do.

If an agreement is reached and the government can remain in power, then that is down to the different parties to decide. I, like the British Prime Minister, have offered to provide all my support. What I want to see is the institutions remaining in operation in Northern Ireland. It is my responsibility as the Taoiseach to guarantee that the Good Friday Agreements are applied in full. They have not been applied in full and there is still a great deal of work to do. That can only be done when institutions work and the institutions can only work when there is a government in place that can operate, and we do not have that at this time and hence I hope that the talks that are held from now until Monday focus on this.

If things are not resolved and the Secretary of State firstly has to dissolve the NI Assembly and then call elections on a pre-determined date, this election process will be under way when the Prime Minister formally notifies the application of Article 50 and the election process, if carried out, will take place in February. If, in the meantime, Article 50 is activated, then the negotiations may start and at that time I will have received the visit from the British Prime Minister, due to take place at the end of January. Perhaps we will then be in a position to know more clearly what the proposal is on the type of relationship that the British Government wants with the European Union henceforth, because that is where the main political challenges lie. That is what will need to be negotiated and that is what interests both Spain and Ireland.

I would like to think that there could be a similar situation to the present one on the issue of opportunities and trade from that time. Recently, as you know, the pound has suffered many ups and downs that have already cost between 300 and 500 million euros. These are very high figures, and hence this is a very serious question.

I thus hope that talks can be held between today and tomorrow in Northern Ireland and through until Monday. If progress is made, Dublin and London will support this. If it is necessary to call elections, they will need to be held and we will then see the results of this. In other words, what is necessary is trust, equality and respect.

President of the Government.- That was certainly one of the issues we discussed at the meeting we just held. I would like to say that our current collaboration is a significant collaboration, both in the fight against terrorism and the fight against crime, to try to eliminate the impunity some seem to have. What we have agreed is to increase this collaboration, I repeat, with the fundamental aim of being as effective as possible. Hence, this is one of the important agreements we have adopted today.

On the matter of the fight against terrorism and, in general, in the fight against organised crime, today and increasingly more so in the future, this war cannot be waged alone. It makes no sense because the borders have come down for almost everyone. Hence, in the end, what makes us more effective is for our intelligence services to collaborate, for them to work together, for them to provide each other with the information they have and for them to act to ensure they are as effective as possible.

Hence, at this time I believe we are working well, but we have agreed to do so even better in the future and with further resources made available by both parties.

Q.- I had a couple of questions for the President of the Government of Spain. I would like to know whether you share the idea that was mentioned at the FAES forum this morning that the centre-right, specifically the People's Party (PP), abandoned, to a great extent, its ideological principles in favour of manoeuvres to win more votes and has renounced presenting a shared project to inspire our citizens. I would like to know whether you feel that this, at the right time, could be rectified at the upcoming PP party congress.

I would also like to know if you back the change in criteria adopted by the Minister for Defence in the Yak-42 affair, and whether you believe this change is a question of justice and when you will recall Ambassador Trillo from the embassy in London.

President of the Government.- In all truth, it makes no sense whatsoever for me to comment on what some people say, above all without having heard them. So, allow me to exercise, in the best possible way, my responsibilities as President of the People's Party and as President of the Government. I think anything else would make no sense.

Aside from that, I agree with the position adopted by the minister. This is a tremendously unfortunate incident in which many people lost their lives, which took place a number of years ago and which has gone through the court process. But, at any event, I would like, as the minister has done, to declare our solidarity and our recognition to all the families and we are obviously going to do everything we can to help improve their situation.

Aside from that, as you are aware, many ambassadors were appointed back in 2012. The mandate of ambassadors tends to last between three and a half and four years. We have gone through a complex period in Spain, with a caretaker government in place for ten months, and hence, even people who were retired or should have retired on the grounds of age have remained in their posts. We are now starting - and have in fact already started this because proposed appointments for several embassies have already officially been notified in a process that will go on for the next few weeks - to renew all the appointments that took place back in 2012 and, as part of this renewal process, all of those ambassadors who were appointed in 2012 will leave their posts.

Now, if you ask me for a specific date, I cannot give you one at this time but, I repeat, this is a process that already started at the previous Council of Ministers, on the 30th, and which will continue over the course of the next few weeks because, I repeat, it is now time for them all to be renewed.

Thank you very much for attending and a good afternoon to you.